Military Families Speak Out (MFSO) has not reached a consensus on the U.S. Military Role in Afghanistan.
Sean Donahue on the Headquarters Staff of MFSO wrote that, "MFSO does not have a position on the U.S. military role in Afghanistan, primarily because it is an issue around which our membership has historically been greatly divided. With so many members’ loved ones being sent to Afghanistan the issue has become much more pressing lately and I know our Board of Directors will be meeting soon to discuss how to best engage in a discussion of Afghanistan with MFSO members."
Though not on the National Board of Veterans for Peace (VFP) or Vietnam Veterans Against the War (VVAW), I receive this response from passionate anti-Iraq War writer/activist Ward Reilly from Baton Rouge, Louisiana:
"Bobby you asked "for the official response from leaders in THE ANTI-IRAQNAM WAR MOVEMENT." Then you said, "I personally have and see nothing wrong with Senator Obama retaining a policy of "Win the war on terrorism/redeploy (or deploy) troops from Iraq to Afghanistan" as long as Senator Obama makes it CLEAR to the American people that he expects WE THE PEOPLE to make all out sacrifices (including THE DRAFT) in order to sustain, let alone win, any War on Terror.
No offense, and with all respect intended, but exactly how do you "win a war on terror"? It’s impossible. The moment you (militarily) invade an innocent nation, you have lost the moral high ground, any local support, and the "war"…especially when you kill hundreds of thousands in the process.
More to follow, but suffice it to say that those most ACTIVE in the anti-Iraq War movement since the Invasion and Occupation of Iraq way back in 2003 are divided on just how to deal with Afghanistan and any politicians plans to divert attention from Iraq to Afghanistan.
The next post AFTER this one will hopefully make using military operations to fight the War on Terror obsolete. It is a defense report from RAND Corporation that questions the phrase "War on Terror," instead calling it what it is – Counter-Terrorism.
Bobby Hanafin, The Mustang Major
IS THERE REALLY A WAR ON TERROR?
SHOULD WHAT THE U.S. IS DOING IN BOTH IRAQ AND AFGHANISTAN BE CALLED SOMETHING ELSE, AND WHAT IS THE MOST EFFECTIVE WAY TO DEAL WITH TERRORISM?
These are questions that I hope will be addressed in the next two posts.
"Exactly how do you "win a war on terror"? It’s impossible. The moment you (militarily) invade an innocent nation, you have lost the moral high ground, any local support, and the "war"…especially when you kill hundreds of thousands in the process." Ward Reilly, Veterans for Peace (VFP) and writer/activists for Vietnam Veterans Against the War (VVAW).
"Terror" is an ideal, and it’s not a thing you can "defeat". Our "War on Terror" is a war OF terror, for all involved, Middle Easterners, and for our troops. Our troops are being used as occupational-oppressors and policemen, not as soldiers. They are sitting targets fighting an invisible enemy.
Although not a member of the VVAW board, I am heavily involved "in the streets" in the movement, and the Veterans on the street say "U.S. out of Afghanistan and Iraq, now". We have to save THIS country, and we will never be able to export to other countries what we don’t practice here (democracy). Our Constitution has been shredded by criminals in Congress and the White House. Bush and Cheney need to be in jail, for committing Constitutional crimes AND invading 2 innocent nations. You know what we all swore a blood oath to; "….to defend the Constitution against all enemies, both foreign and DOMESTIC". Bush and Cheney lied us into both "wars".
If it is truly necessary to take out "evil terrorists", such as bin Laden, then it should be done by assassination of single targets, with NO casualties to any innocent citizens, and done by our incredible Special Forces, who can easily kill any single man with proper planning. In and out, game over. The neocons want the "wars" to continue, in occupation form, because war is a money-making monster for them, especially with our new "privatized" army.
I don’t speak for the organization as an officer, but most of our members feel this way, in my opinion. Afghanistan IS NOT "the good war". It’s the same as Iraq. Illegal, immoral, unconstitutional, and criminal.
No Draft. The people of this country will defend it if we are attacked by any invading military.
U.S. Military COMPLETELY out of Afghanistan and Iraq, yesterday.
The real questions are, can we force Obama to act on the will of the Majority of our citizens (70%) who want us out of both countries, NOW, and can we save the Constitution peacefully, or not?
(Sp4) Ward Reilly, SE national contact, VVAW
Veterans For Peace
IVAW Advisory Board member
11c40 C 1/16 1st ID 71-74
Selective Service Board member
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A DIVERSE VIEW ON BEHALF OF BARACK OBAMA
This feedback was sent to me by Brother Stephen Noetzel of California, who I’ve known since 2003 and personally met in March 2005 at the first formulating meeting of the democrat party leaning Veterans and Military Families for Progress in Wisconsin. I frankly disagree with the views of many moderates to right of center Veterans and Military Families who met there; however their opinions are to be just as respected as mine or Stan Goff’s.
Steve called his feedback, "My Dissenting view on Afghanistan," and despite his title, he in reality is defending and promoting Senator Obama’s position on Afghanistan (or SW. Asia).
For those not familiar with the seed of discussion, I sent out a request for feedback from folks within the Peace Movement whose views I respect even if I do not agree with them. My promise was to put together an article that expressed all opinions among those who find consensus on but one decision: NONE OF THE FOLKS THAT I CONTACTED WILL BE VOTING FOR JOHN MCCAIN!
That said, if someone expressed an opinion or promoted a position on any Independent Presidential Candidate, I will also share their views. The only restriction I place on my reporting is that no opinions in support of John McCain will be articulated for fear that I or others be labeled a McCain supporter. My intent was NEVER to write a long winded pro or anti-McCain campaign ad, but to LEGITIMATELY QUESTION those WE were seriously considering VOTING FOR!
Stephan says that, "I have been reading the interesting posts on Peace Movement Policy on Afghanistan. I wasn’t going to ring-in on this but [my name was mentioned]. May as well offer my two cents, some of you know of my history with VVAW. I go back to the Original Crew in NYC. I was an active member and organizer as early as ’69 & ’70. I testified at the original WSI in Detroit, and I testified w/ Kerry in congress. I traveled on speaking tour w/ Jane. TV appearances regarding my testimony on war crimes I observed as a Green Beret in ‘Nam. I worked w/ Bobby Muller [founder of Vietnam Veterans of America (VVA) and former VVAW member] on Long Island to organize a mini-WSI at the Garden City Hotel in Republican Nassau County the summer after the original. I ran an activist VVAW chapter @ Queens College. [Count] me [among] the ‘originals’ Jan, Urgo, Bangert, hell, even Al H. Ditto with the Citizens Commission, ask Rifkin, Uhl, Todd. Ask all the old saints. I mention all this not because I think my view on Afghanistan has any more validity than yours, but simply to establish that I have been in lock-step with liberal/progressive (even) radical political views, lo these many years. I then got bitten by the Political Bug and been there ever since.
I worked in the Allard Lowenstein ‘comeback’ campaign – till he got shot. Would have worked in the Bobby Kennedy Campaign, but he got shot. His older bro sent me to ‘Nam, then got shot while I was there. [NOTE: Steve’s positon IS NOT to be taken as any OFFICIAL position of the Obama Campaign only one among thousands of campaign volunteers. Bobby Hanafin]
When I started working in the Obama campaign over a year ago, I never told them these things. Remember why the Spinal Tap guys couldn’t find a new drummer? That’s right, a Jinx, six previous drummers died on the job.
The thing is, though I say ‘lock-step’. I was never into Group-think. I marched in step because I was in full agreement. When I disagreed, I simply didn’t march. I don’t march with the Replace Israel with Palestine crowd. It’s WAY more complicated than that.
I don’t march with the Hands Off Afghanistan crowd. It’s a bit more complicated than that. Not a lot, but a bit. Lot’s of people know I’m no Hawk. Fewer know I’m also not a pacifist. I ‘cherry pick,’ that’s why I like the name VVAW better than VFP.
Though I moved out of NYC in the mid-70s and now feel perfectly at home here in the land of fruits and nuts, I still get highly pissed when I see occasional film of the Towers coming down. My ‘New Yorker’ patriotism kicks in. I’m not yet evolved to the point where I’m ready to let bygones be bygones around 9/11/01. I want justice. Hell I’m baser than that. I want revenge. But revenge against the perpetrators and that doesn’t rule out GW Bush and his henchmen as far as I’m concerned. I long for the day when there’s a crack in that insulation. But I sure as hell did enough homework to know who the ‘rag head’ scumbags are. That’s why I got so pissed (with barrack Obama and 30-million other Americans.), when King George told me we’ll get our revenge by attacking…Iraq?
No sale douche-bag. Not for a minute. That’s why I started working with OIF vets to start Iraq Veterans Against the War (IVAW) here in the Bay Area as early as 2003 – a full year before the finally evolved at the VFP convention in ’04.
But Afghanistan, that’s where that OBL (Osama Bin Laden) bastard was hiding. IS hiding, and continues to hide.
What also starts to ‘kick-in’ is the old ‘Mission Mentality’ of my Sneaky Pete training. That’s why NONE of the arguments against going after that bastard make a lick of sense to me.
Let’s talk ‘Mission’. Though I knew from the very start of ‘Shock and Awe’ that the ‘mission’ that Bush conjured up to invade IRAQ (f’gadsake) was outrageous (whatever it was)…Once it got started I was SURE he had enough experienced military people advising him to insure that there was a clear MISSION to this bombastic excuse for a war. I’ll be honest. If the Bush Mission turned out to be revenge against Hussein for trying to kill papa Bush, I would have begrudgingly even given him that. Had he ‘pulled out’ (like poppa did) after clumsily accomplishing his ‘mission, (i.e. Topple Hussein) I could have held my nose and swallowed that. Under two conditions, first, that they
destroyed/secured the WMDs, and second, that they (re-) turned IMMEDIATELY to the primary mission (that being) full force deployment to the capture of the Bastard OBL.
That Mission, I insist is viable. Don’t tell this old Green Beanie it’s not. The Israeli Special Forces used to excel at this. Until they started taking lessons from Rumsfeld & Co. on How to [Screw] Up a Perfectly Good War.
The mullahs, sheep-herders, and poppy-farmers in Afghanistan are bigger Ho’s than Ho Chi Minh and his Charlie’s ever were. They had a lot of True Believers. Of COURSE the Russians got their ass kicked when they tried a conventional war in Afghanistan. Same-same the French at Dien Bien Phu, and same-same ‘Hello Marines -Welcome to our Tet Celebration!’. Of course if the Mission is not clear and concise, and if the Strategy is
CFM (Clear as Mud remember?) there will be "Instant Afquagimire" (This coinage with apology to [Bobby] Hanafin who long has touted his appropriate "Iraqinam" term).
I insist that with a disciplined effort and a rigorously controlled MISSION, there are poppy-farmers and Mullahs that will give up OBL and his hole-in-the-wall gang (for the right price), and Sneaky Pete can get in there and Spirit him Out. Yes, there may be some collateral damage – as the slime-ball insulates him self with civilian hostages, but if the MISSION is right the job can be done with minimal civilian loss – less than a hundred souls. Maybe even less than the number of souls who jumped from the 110th floor to avoid live cremation. Maybe it would get messy enough so that the Bastard OBL might not make it out alive. Choy Oi. Or even ‘sin loi’. Or whatever is the equivalent in Arabic.
The Taliban can be broken beyond repair within two months – no longer. Not mopped up to the last Al Qaida True Believer, but enough to break their back. Enough to convince the poppy farmers and sheep herders (who like the Taliban about as much as the Rice Farmers of Tan Phu liked the occupiers of the NVA or the USA!) that they don’t need this trash in their ‘hood either!
Mission Accomplished. Neat and relatively clean. Then we go back to defending our borders and paying attention to waz happnin’ in our own ‘hood. THEN, and only then, I go back to being a Peacenik.
That’s my view guys. I don’t know what kind of Mission Barack Obama has in mind for Afghanistan – but I know he has good sense. Tell you what. I’ll take my chances with his version of the Afghanistan Mission over that of the dim bulb McCain. I think he’ll be happy enough to have the history books read "It took Obama to get Osama".
He was smart enough to see that Iraqinam was bullshit, and he’s smart enough to avoid ‘Afquagimire’.
But we have a job to do there first. He knows it, I know it, and I’m confident that a lot of peace-loving vets know it as well.
That’s my view comrades, and the best evidence I have for it is when Obama speaks perceptively about ‘not just ending the war, but starting to end the War Culture’ that America has become during the nightmare of Iraqinam.
And as a final note to Bobby Hanafin. When the Afghanistan Mission has been accomplished (about a year from right now), I agree that to rebuild the security of our Republic, we need to institute the "oblitunity’ of an organized system of Mandatory National Service for every single young person living in the US…male or female, citizen or no, handicapped or no, gay or straight, rich or poor.
All sincere replies sincerely appreciated.
Yours for an America to Love again,
Steve Noetzel, Co-Director, California Veterans for Obama
(Former) San Francisco Co-coordinator – Veterans for Kerry
Nigh-unto 40 year member, VVAW and
5-year mentor to IVAW
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I believe it is safe to say that the most active or "have been in the streets Veterans and Military Family organizations who have QUESTIONED the Iraq War have pretty much the same divided position on the role of U.S. Military in Afghanistan. From feedback I have received and consider the most reasonable and realistic, I conclude that much of the division within those groups and organizations that QUESTION the Iraq War, much less OPPOSE it, revolves around how the rank and file has either been sold on the concept of a Global War on Terror (GWOT) or don’t buy it. On that note I continue with an intellectual discussion of the GWOT by long time Peace Activist Stan Goff. Stan has been part of and with those folks who QUESTION and OPPOSE the Iraq War BEFORE day one of the Invasion of Iraq. After digesting the political games being played with what it takes to be Commander-In-Chief, Stan goes on to insightfully take issue with the same political gamesmanship being played with the Global War on Terror (GWOT) by both established political parties and Presidential campaigns trying to outdo themselves on not only continuing to promote and sell the GWOT myth but to compete with each other on which political party can best deal with the GWOT.
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On Commanding-in-Chief by Stan Goff
Or, Welcome to Global War On Terror (GWOT) world.
http://www.feralscholar.org/blog/index.php/2008/07/21/on-commanding-in-chief/
This analysis was submitted by William Terry Leichner, RN, a Denver member of Vietnam Veterans Against the War (VVAW), USMC combat infantryman – 5th Marines….Dec 1967-Feb 1969. Brother Leichner posted this excellent commentary by fellow military retiree, and Peace Activist, Stan Goff. Stan has been instrumental in the Anti-Iraqnam War movement even before the Invasion of Iraq began in 2003 (along with most of the folks I’ve received feedback from). With the exception of a non-committal statement from Military Families Speak Out (MFSO) due to the different views on Afghanistan within that organization and lacking an annual meeting to reach any consciences, NONE of the feedback that I quote in this article is to be perceived as an OFFICIAL policy, views, or opinion of VVAW, Veterans for Peace, or any other organization with "AGAINST," or "PEACE" in their logos and/or banners.
To make my intent clear, the mainstream media interviewed and quoted so-called anti-Iraqnam War groups or organization members who are NOT Veterans or Military Family Members. I’m not degrading the contributions of non-Veteran or non-Military Family focused peace groups in anyway, but the American public should not be given the illusion that groups such as Moveon.org. United for Peace and Justice, and such SPEAK for or on behalf of America’s Veterans and Military Families who QUESTION, let alone OPPOSE the Iraq War or HAVE QUESTIONS or CONCERNS about escalating WAR in Afghanistan without the full commitment and burden sharing of the American people. WE THE PEOPLE look at war beyond our shores as divorced from the U.S. economy, as WE focus on the economy or are distracted by politicians and the media to GET OFF focus on just HOW prosecuting any war and our national economy cannot be separated.
Extracted below is what Peace Activist Stan Goff had to say about the War on Terror and Afghanistan in his commentary, "On Commanding-in-Chief," on his outstanding blog The Feral Scholar. Thanks Stan for this insightful, thought provoking insight.
Bobby Hanafin
The Mustang Major
PS: For every view and opinion, I intend posting an opposite or diverse opinion from folks that I sincerely and passionately RESPECT. I more than adequately express our military families’ opinion in the first half of my commentary.
FROM "ON COMMANDING-IN-CHIEF," Stan Goff says, "The media focus…cops to the most dangerous accomplishment of the Bush administration: the publicly-accepted idea of a "global war on terror."
There is no such thing, of course. There is a war to control Southwest Asia and its strategic resources. The "global war on terror" (GWOT) is a legal pretext that apparently slipped right past all those fine lawyers in Congress.
What GWOT does is consolidate US executive control over both domestic and foreign policy, by redefining the entire planet as a battlefield. This "global battle space" justifies actions that are only sanctioned by international law on the battlefield.
"The whole world" cannot be shoehorned into any definition of a "battlefield" embodied in international law on the issue of war. That’s one of several reasons the US won’t sign onto the International Criminal Court.
The GWOT is simply rhetorical cover for a naked political power-grab. And this suits a Democratic executive just as nicely as it does a Republican one as Congress has demonstrated in its perpetuation by word and deed of the GWOT myth.
That is why – even though it’s not a sexy issue – debunking the GWOT assumption of a "global battle space" is one of the most crucial debates we can have about the war. It goes way beyond just Iraq, and set the stage for Guantanamo, rendition, et al.
The lawyer running against McCain (Obama) is play-acting at having missed this pre-textual fiction, too; because he talks about winning this GWOT himself. That commits him whether he likes it or not.
That is why after he wins the Presidency, Barack Obama – our new commander-in-chief – will find himself becoming the Lyndon Johnson of Afghanistan. and the US will continue sending troops to die for control of strategic resources through his entire term.
Meanwhile, the world and the nation will grow poorer and meaner. It may even be during Obama’s first term that the debt ledge, public and private, snaps off (catastrophically). As the ledge plummets into the abyss with all of us tumbling behind, so his popularity will plunge down with us as inexorably as Bush’s has. The war didn’t destroy Bush’s ratings; losing it did.
Obama will not only be caught between the Scylla and Charybdis of Wall Street and a pissed-off public; he will be trying to win an unwinnable war in Afghanistan and Iraq. All he will do is shift the center of gravity from Iraq to Afghanistan, which is already shifting as the Taliban expands its power into the interstices of the current NATO occupation.
I know, I know. You’ve heard the media say Obama wants to leave Iraq. That’s because they don’t listen and don’t want you to.
Obama has never called for a withdrawal from Iraq. He talks the al-Qaeda-babble just as enthusiastically as Dick Cheney, in fact, and has called for a permanent US occupation of Iraq, linguistically disguised as "over watch" with Special Operations on call.
Any withdrawal (that is, troop draw-downs) remains contingent on "the Iraqis." This means the squabbling cliques inside the Green Zone, not most Iraqis.
The trigger for discontinuing the occupation, then, is the "government of Iraq" taking measures that they are unlikely to take, and over which the US has nearly no control. meaning these redeployment triggers will never be pulled.
This bait-and-switch worked for Bush, and it will work for Obama until our sheer exhaustion with the war and the domestic economic crisis force a change on the Obama administration.
Obama started his campaign for commander-in-chief with the easy – and false – critique that the Bush administration was killing the wrong people. It’s not Iraqis we need to kill, but Afghans. His popular deception is not that Iraq is responsible for 9-11. His implication is that Afghanistan did 9-11because bin Laden was there.
Again, not true, but why let that hold you back. The Taliban government of Afghanistan tried to give the US Osama bin Laden before 9-11. Since the US had invasion plans on the table, they didn’t want to lose the bin Laden pretext, and they refused. The attacks of 9-11-01 were conducted by 15 Saudis, one Egyptian, one Lebanese, and two citizens of the United Arab Emirates. No Afghans. No Iraqis.
Here is something that is true about Afghanistan though. Guerrilla war against outsiders has always succeeded there. And it is succeeding now against the US and NATO. The loss of a US perimeter base near the Pakistani border last week is just a foreshadowing of where the war there is headed. This is the war that Obama wants to fight?
Yet he seems to have trapped himself in it already. He says that Afghanistan is being lost because there are too many US troops tied down in Iraq. Does he propose then that the current institutional trend lines in the military be maintained? More expensive recruitment and lower recruitment standards, falling morale, an unsustainable operations tempo, the reward of criminality and incompetence in the leadership, and reliance on $180,000-a-year mercenaries to take up the slack?
Obama claims that he is going to fight terrorism by attacking Afghans instead of Iraqis, as well as maintain an "over watch" presence of tens of thousands of troops in Iraq. Where will the troops come from?
Well, he has stated that he wants to expand the ground forces by 93,000 (both Army and Marines).
Lyndon Johnson started out like this, nickel-diming, and eventually found himself with 500,000 American troops occupying Vietnam. Several years later, the last US troops were literally driven out of Vietnam at gunpoint. Johnson didn’t run that war; the war ran him.
That’s where Obama is headed right now; and for the record, that does not mean there is no difference between him and McCain, or that I am encouraging electoral abstinence. Those are red herrings. It means the war has in many respects escaped the calculable control of the American state no matter who the President is.
Obama will be the next chief executive of the American state – a state by, for, and of the business class. That’s the job description. That business class depends on the larger economy which is materially dependent on massive and unceasing throughputs of fossil hydrocarbons. That same economy has been overrun by rentier capitalists who have driven the global economy over a cliff.
Competitors are on the horizon, China, Russia, India, Brazil, but mostly Western Europe. The war is one central drama in a multiply-determined crisis that also includes immanent food shortages, water famines, radical climate shifts, and the general decay of inter-class stability.